American Family in Chengdu Questions

[MikeV]

Hi,

First off I’d like to say it’s great to see such an active and vibrant forum here. As an outsider it really helps to give some view into Chengdu life (no matter how limited), so I really appreciate the website and forum participation.

Here’s the deal: we’re a family of 4 (mom, dad, 2 year old, 4 year old) from the San Francisco Bay Area, considering moving to Chengdu for 1-2 years. The motivation is a mix of cultural exchange, helping dad (me) to improve my Mandarin, and frankly for a new adventure and different perspective on life. The in-laws and extended family live in Chengdu, so it’d also be an opportunity for the kids to get to know their grandparents and extended family better.

I’m wondering if anyone on the forum has any advise, recommendations, personal experience to share, etc regarding the following questions:

– How difficult is it for a US family to get a 1-2 year Chinese Visa? We plan to either work for a US company remotely from Chengdu, or perhaps find some part-time work there.

– How suitable is Chengdu for an expat family with small children? e.g., is it generally safe and welcoming? We’d probably consider the Yulin neighborhood for residence.

– What are the schools like for Kindergarten/Pre-K children? Are there a wide variety of schools, and do they provide decent education? The kids speak some Mandarin.

– Any other advise for an American expat family with small kids considering this move?

We’ll be visiting Chengdu in about 4 weeks (I’ve been there before about 8 years ago, and my wife was born/raised there but left about 20 years ago), so I’m hoping I can get an idea of what to focus on while we’re there. Perhaps we can even catch an event (pub crawl, party, Natooke bike shop, etc) and chat with you in person. Thanks in advance for any feedback!!

[trudat]

As far as I can remember, being that your wife was born in China, she could get a 2 year visa. But you and your kids are another matter. Make sure to get marriage and birth certificates (for your children) translated into Chinese and authenticated by the Chinese consulate in SF plus whatever is the “state department” for California (perhaps the Lt. Gov’s office). When you get a job, your new employer will handle getting you a work visa. Then your children can fall under that and get matching tourist visas (I believe).

Preschools are jam packed with kids and may require registration at least one year in advance to get in.

[Brent]

Hi Mike, my wife & I have been living in Chengdu for 1.5 yrs and have a 20 month old son. The city is a good choice for a young family. It’s very safe and OVER welcoming! Foreign kids are like celebrities here. The cities very modern, good schools and lots of international food products available for young children (and adults). My son will go to Soong Ching Ling International Kindergarten next semester (ages 1.5-6yrs). It’s very expensive but it seems to be the best kindergarten in Chengdu from what I have seen. I can get you a big discount if you decide its a nice school otherwise you can check out Golden Apple, it’s another international kindergarten.

[Charlie]

Hi Mike, welcome to the forum.

To answer your questions:

– There’s always a solution to visa problems in China, they usually involve paperwork and fees. There’s a visa service company that we advertise for called Shan Shui Visa, and they’re about the most knowledgeable visa consultants you will find in Chengdu. You might be able to get a marriage visa through your wife if she’s a Chinese citizen, otherwise an F (business) visa might be appropriate. It doesn’t require you to actually do business, but you might pay in the range of 3,000 yuan (about $450) for a 6-month visa with very few questions asked. You might want to ask Shan Shui about the details.

– Golden Apple is an option for your kids, as is the Waldorf School. I don’t know much about the pros and cons of these options but I think Sascha does (one of the main contributors to Chengdu Living). I will send him a link to this thread, he’s an American here with two kids as well.

There are more expats with kids in Chengdu than ever before, and accordingly more services to accomodate families with kids. Overall I think it would be a good experience for your family. Like bwezza said, everyone is really friendly here to foreigners in general and that goes doubly for foreign children. China is like that in general but Chengdu especially so. Expect a lot of people to say hello to your kids and want to be friendly with them, interaction with strangers is probably more common in China than any other country I’ve been in.

If you have any other questions, feel free to ask.

[Sascha]

Hi there,

I guess the first thing I would do is check out our Series page where we have a 11 (12?) part series on raising a kid in China. It might not be totally relevant to you, but there will be some info in there for you. I am working on an education post for that series, and I will finish it before you visit, so keep checking the forum/blog cuz it will pop up.

My basic answer is Yes, Chengdu is a good place for families. I myself would find it hard to leave the Bay. For anything. But there is a lot the city and area has to offer, especially since your kids are a bit older. Lotsa school options here. The kindergartens above are expensive

@bwezza, what kind of discount? i may be interested.

but you’re gonna want to spend the money. There are several Waldorf-inspired kindergartens here and they are sweet and not as expensive. (400US per month … ). There are other options as well, seeing as you want your kids to experience China. Call me/email me when you get in.

Your biggest issue will be visas for everyone. Not sure about your wife really. Did she give up Chinese citizenship? I assume so, which makes her a foreigner. Tourist visas last 90 days or 180 days tops. And they require monthly extensions in some cases. Any other visa (business, work, study) requires that you actually go through the hoops (start a business/get a job HERE/enroll in a school).

Sure, you can buy a visa from Shan Shui and others, but for a family you don’t want any visa issues at all. Trust me. You’ll want to be very above board and clear about the visa thing. I would suggest enrolling in Sichuan University. They love families.

Be sure to contact me when you arrive.

[Eric]

i think charlie’s got you covered on the visa thing.

there are a lot of foreigners with kids here. i don’t really know what’s up with that, but that appears to be the case! i’ve heard a lot of things from golden apple, but yes i would put that up there on the price range.

finally, know that in china, diapers and baby powders and many baby products in general are not very safe. in fact, many chinese people flock over to hong kong to pick up foreign brands of baby products every year.

[Sascha]

Nobody “got you covered” on the visa thing. If you are here with a family, and you are a foreigner, there are two options and two options only:

1) Get a job

2) Go back to school

These options provide you with a long term stable visa.

Diapers are fine here, the worst thing you’ll find is that the cheaper ones don’t absorb much. But your kids are pretty much past that stage anyway. Buy Pampers and you’ll be fine. For everything else, things have gotten much better in the last 1-2 years. Again, refer to the Series page for a story about Importing Baby Products. Lots of good links/info in the comment section as well.

I would bring:

– medicine (colds, virus stuff, fever stuff etc)

– as much US toothpaste and shampoo for kids as you can …

– a nice water filter

– a case full of deep frozen fish burritos and some of those Honduran cakes, pampas? Nanas? and then call me so I can “help you unpack”

[MikeV]

@trudat, @bwezza, @Charlie, @Sascha, @iameric – many many thanks for your feedback. The information regarding the schools and visas in particular is immensely helpful. If we get the opportunity to meet up I’d like to buy you guys a beer 🙂

@Sascha – yes, we love San Francisco and the Bay Area and will return (if we actually get the opportunity to make it to Chengdu). But it’s been home for almost 15 years, so it’s time to mix things up a bit – I’m certain you can relate to what I’m saying. My wife is a US citizen, and does not have Chinese citizenship any longer. I will look into enrolling at Sichuan University. BTW I had previously read your series – very informative and nice writing, and I’m looking forward to your upcoming post on education. I hope we get the opportunity to meet up with you on our visit next month!

@Charlie – according to china-embassy.org, the “L” (Tourist) Visa has a “Multiple Entry for 24 Months” option: http://www.china-embassy.org/eng/hzqz/zgqz/t84246.htm

Do you know anyone who has been able to get that? I will take your advice and contact Shan Shui to see if they can enlighten me on all of my options.

@bwezza – can you tell me the address of Soong Ching Ling International Kindergarten? I Googled it and found their Shanghai locations, but could not find their facility in Chengdu. I emailed them but have not yet heard back – it’d be great if we can check it out on Google Maps and swing by when we’re in town.

Thanks again everyone! I have a lot more questions but will save those for another thread some other day.

-mike

[Charlie]

Quote:

@Charlie – according to china-embassy.org, the “L” (Tourist) Visa has a “Multiple Entry for 24 Months” option: http://www.china-embassy.org/eng/hzqz/zgqz/t84246.htm

Do you know anyone who has been able to get that? I will take your advice and contact Shan Shui to see if they can enlighten me on all of my options.

I’ve seen 12 month tourist visas but 24 months would be incredible. I’d estimate that at least 50% of foreigners in China are scheming their way through the visa process in one way or another, so it’s not really like other countries in that regard. The solution to visa problems is almost always money, what changes is who you give the money to. Sometimes you’ll have to pay the government directly, pay a visa consulting company (like Shan Shui), enroll at school, etc. Some people enroll at school and don’t even attend classes just for the visa, others just buy business visas and live here doing whatever they want (I did that for years).

[Eric]

US toothpaste and shampoo? i dont know… i think the products here are fine.

water filter? more like an air filter. if you’ve looked at the chengdu air pollution twitter, you would be scared to breath in chengdu.

but in terms of items to bring over, it really depends on how you’re getting there. if you have a job and are getting everything crated over to you, then heck bring as much stuff as you want. but if you’re literally just hopping on a plane and starting “a new life” here with a few suitcases and boxes, then you might want to hold out a bit on the liquids.

I find that for most people though, food is important. there’s a lot of food you’re gonna miss eating/making back home that is impossible to get here or just stupidly expensive.

Basically, chengdu’s got a lot. but keep in mind that “imported items” have the foreign tax and the retailer markup.

[trudat]

My parents born in China and HK got 2 year visas. But they had help from a personal friend who has connections at the consulate. Check out this site in Google Chrome for automatic translation into English: http://visa.ywpw.com/visatypes/visa_l2y.html

For milk, we buy imported New Zealand milk powder on TaoBao:

http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=9653183639

Ends up being cheaper than buying fresh milk obviously and tastes pretty good when you use a blender. Plus its imported so we feel safe.

When you get here read up on http://taobaofieldguide.com/ to figure out TaoBao. You can buy almost anything online on Taobao.

We bought a very nice Midea brand water filter from a local Guomei appliance store (which are everywhere). They sent a guy to install it under our sink. We always have a supply of super clean water on a secondary tap on our kitchen sink. Very convenient and better tasting than bottled water. Every 6 months they send a technician to assess whether the filter cartridges need to be swapped out for new ones.

Be sure to take Sascha’s advice on children’s tylenol. Can’t get that here. They don’t believe in it.

From what I hear, if you want to make friends with locals, don’t move to the upscale Tongzilin neighborhood.

[Sascha]

good stuff.

basically, with visas, you have to do the leg work. the embassy may offer 24 months, but i have never seen one. Things change so often here and a lot of the time it seems somewhat arbitrary. just be sure you have the bases covered.

[Brent]

Yeah the visa issue is an ongoing problem with no ‘easy’ quick fix solution (not sure about if your wife has other options). The most stable option for your family would be to get a Z-Visa (working visa) that your family can also stay here on. That means getting a job which is easy if you are willing to teach in Chengdu. If you need a job just PM me your resume. Shan Shui is a good service and have helped me out a lot but I have referred a lot of people to them and they just get told that there is nothing they can do to help so don’t rely just on them.

Be careful with the 12 or 24 month tourist visas, I had one last year and it ended up being a very expensive visa. The condition it said that we had a maximum of 60 days stay. That means the 3 of us had to visit HK every 2 months. So just check with the conditions of your country (I’m from Aust.)

Baby/children products are renowned in China for being bad for the kids health. We got everything we needed, which was all imported stuff, from Carrefore or Taobao. The only items we ever have friends bring us is medical stuff (Panadole, baby/infant panadole [tylenol], nurefen plus, etc etc). It seems impossible to find here and way overpriced on Taobao.

@Sascha – I have asked for the discounted price & I will PM you when they get back to me. They gave me a really good deal. Still a bit expensive but worth it.

@MikeV – There is no Shanghai school. It is Soong Ching Ling International Kindergarten which is different to the school in Shanghai.

http://www.scledu.org/scl/index.aspx

The address is: SCL 成都园地址（SCL ChengDu Campus）

成都市高新区锦尚西二路599号

@trudat – We live in the Tongzilin area and 90% of our friends that we hang with are locals so I don’t think it makes too much difference where you live.

[Valerie]

Mike,

I currently work for a new Kindergarten in the Hi- Tech area of Chengdu, just a little south of the 3rd ring, and since we are new to Chengdu, we currently have many openings. We are almost done with the renovations on the new facility and might be a good option for your children if you relocate. I have heard that there is a shortage of kindergartens in Chengdu and wait- lists can be very long? It is a bit pricey, but it seems like a great program so far.

Website: http://www.eagletw.com

Two programs: International kindergarten (All day English)

Bilingual program (Half day Chinese/ English lessons)

[MikeV]

@Charlie, @iameric, @trudat, @Sascha, @bwezza, @Valerie – awesome information, thanks so much. We’ll pay a visit to American Eagle Institute and Soong Ching Ling International Kindergarten during our visit next month, as well as the Waldorf and Golden Apple. @bwezza, if Soong Ching looks like the best option I will PM you regarding the potentially discounted price.

After chatting with you all, I’m coming to the conclusion that a Student (X) Visa is probably my best option, and I guess that means I need to get the rest of my family an accompanying L-Visa. I totally agree about not screwing around with the Visas – potentially having to haul the kids off to HK to sort out a visa issue is not something I want to deal with. I’ll look into the programs at SU and SWUN and see if something like that will work.

Thanks again, and I do hope I get the chance to chat with some of you in person. @Sascha, not sure we’ll have room for frozen fish burritos on this trip, but I’ll try to bring along some Ghirardelli chocolate =)

[Sascha]

as far as I remember, schools will generally provide visas for the whole family. They can’t very well give you a visa and then say “good luck with your kids” and in my exp that has never been a problem. My kids always received their visas through whichever institution was providing mine.

chocolate works.

[jock]

For me, I often use taobao agents for shopping. Take Trudat’s words about Taobao item link for example, I can easily get it here.

There’s a 20% fee as their service cost. More purchase may be at lower cost, you can ask by emailing: [email protected]

Hopefully this can help all of us foreigners living in Chengdu.

[Author]

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